Posts Made By: Jon Isaacs

As a dedicated cyclist, Lance was certainly a hero to me. I can remember the cycling forums back in the days of S.A.A., rec.bicycles.racing There was little hope he would live, it looked dark. But come back he did and his book was an inspiration.

But any thinking person had to always suspect he was doing something, to believe in him as a hero required a certain amount of denial. His performances were superhuman and his competition was caught time and time again..

Lance, a hero for certain, a liar, most likely.

Jon

Ernie Spragg said:

let's see - what evidence is there against him? the "sworn" testimony of convicted cheaters and liars.

Unfortunately that does not seem to be the case... George Hincapie, who was very close to Armstrong, and others in the inside circle were apparently prepared to testify against Armstrong.

"But neither had the credibility of Hincapie, Leipheimer, Vande Velde or Zabriskie, riders who also were once a part of Armstrong’s inner circle. Hincapie, Vande Velde and Zabriskie have never tested positive for doping or admitted to any doping. (Leiphemier tested positive for the stimulant ephedrine at the 1996 United States Amateur National Criterium Championships and said it was because of the use of allergy medicine. He was stripped of his victory.)

Hincapie’s word would be especially harmful for Armstrong, considering the two have said they are as close as brothers."

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/a/lance_armstrong/index.html

As much as I would like to believe Armstrong was innocent of all charges, I have to think that the prospect a public confrontation by Hincapie and the others would have been conclusive and any credibility Armstrong has now would be gone. He saw the writing on the wall and made the wise decision.

Bicycle racing is primarily about strategy. To win a stage race, you don't need to win any stages, you need to know how to play your cards to their best advantage. It looks to me like Lance recognized this was one race he was not going to win and decided to save his energy for another day.

Jon

George Saar said:

"A liar most likely". ?????
How many urine tests does it take to " prove" one's innocence? :S
This IS a Which Hunt - "most likely".

Clear skies to all!

G

George:

Are you familiar with bicycle racing, the use of EPO and the measurement of the "hematocrit?" The hematocrit is a measure of the number of red blood cell in the blood. By the way, cyclists face blood tests which are more sensitive than urine testing.

- EPO is a drug that increases the red blood cell count, it was originally meant for use by recovering cancer patients but it is the drug of choice for endurance athletes since it gets more oxygen to their muscles.

The use of EPO is banned but there is no test for the use of EPO. In lieu of a test, a maximum hematocrit level of 50% was established. Anyone with a hematocrit of over 50% is automatically out of the race, Marco Pantani was leading the tour when he was disqualified for having a hematocrit of over 50%.

Basically it's a game, take enough EPO to increase the number of red blood cells but make sure you don't go over 50%. I am sure the team doctors were/are monitoring this...There are other drugs that cannot be detected, other procedures.. It is indeed possible to pass 700 drug tests and still be using performance enhancing drugs.

- George Hincapie was Lance's trusted domestique during his 7 tour wins and the person closest to Lance. The domestique is the rider who tows the team leader for most of the stage and Lance and George were very close. George has ridden in more tours than anyone in history and George has never tested positive for any performance enhancing drugs...

Apparently George was prepared to state that he and Lance had taken EPO together and had supplied it to other members of the team. This was the problem Lance faced, confronting his trusted friend who had also never been caught. There were also 3 other members of Lance's teams who were essentially clean that were prepared to testify against him.

This was the showdown Lance shied away from.

Drugs in sports are big business, doctors and laboratories work on synthetic drugs that cannot be detected. They try to stay ahead of the authorities and often do. Balco was an example. Balco would send blood samples of their athletes drugs to other testing labs to see if the other labs could detect anything. Drugs in cycling is huge, since the days of Miguel Indurain, there have been very few tour de france winners who have not been caught cheating..

Jon Isaacs

jim chung said:

What about the 10 other teammates ready to testify they saw Armstrong doping (and blood transfusions count as cheating).

Yep... I think anyone who is a serious cycle racing fan has a hard time believing Lance is clean. Cycling has far more stringent testing than any American sport with far more serious penalties. But it has been shown time and time again that the drug use not isolated but a concerted effort involving the teams and doctors.

Personally I have to wonder if Indurain was clean...

Jon

"This is a WITCH HUNT"

The validity of EPO testing:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/06/080626100921.htm

Exactly why is that George Hincapie is willing to testify against Lance?

Jon

I don't know how anybody can care about watching a sporting event where the winner today might be stripped of the title tomorrow. I'll never watch the Tour again.

I am an avid cyclist, I love to ride. I have even done a little racing myself. But it's been quite a few years since I had any interest in the pros simply because it seems that just about everyone is cheating. It's not just after the fact that they get caught, Pantani was tossed while leading the tour, Rasmussen was tossed while leading the tour.

For me, it's the fact that they are/were cheating that is important, not when or how they got caught.

Jon Isaacs

Kory Lahue said:

Lance is like Mark McGuire.....a liar. For years Mcguire denied using steroids, then just recently admitted to it. Im a cyclist, and admired Lance for a long time. But the truth has come out, but he wont admit it for the sake of his foundation. One side affect of Lance's actions is testicular cancer, which he developed. He has teammates who are are willing to testify against him, and the USADA wouldnt be going through all this if they didnt have concrete, DNA evidence. Sorry all you Lance fans.......he's proven another loser.....the only "hero" Armstrong is still Neil.

Kory:

Indeed... The fact that Lance and his team were caught up in the drugs is particularly disturbing because of Lance's aggressive posturing on the drug issues. He strongly chastised others who were caught. It's as if Barry Bonds was not only taking the drugs but was claiming to be drug free while chastising Sammy Sosa and Mark McGuire for taking them.

I suspect that this whole affair is more disturbing to cyclists than to the general sporting public. As a cyclist, one is not only watching the competition but comparing the performance of the athletes to one's own meager capabilities. When that performance turns out to be drug aided, it no longer has any meaning.

I wonder how everyone feels about the East German Doping Scandal... that was something that surfaced years later. Those athletes were systematically given drugs by team doctors:

"(Carola) Nitschke was also 13 when doctors started giving her the anabolic steroid Oral-Turinabol and injections of the male hormone testosterone. In 1998, she became the first doped athlete to return her medals and ask that her name be removed from the record books."

13 years old, did not know what she was being given... I have to say, returning her medals (A Gold at Montreal) showed a lot of class.

Jon

Kory Lahue said:

Richard Davis said:
I think he finally figured, why keep fighting this group of Wimps, crybabies, and losers. Just let them have their win. They would hound him 'till the end of time anyway.

If he TRULY was innocent, why not fight for them? He wouldnt just give them up. If you won 7 Tours and an Olympic medal, would you just give them up if you were innocent? Heck no. Lance was caught and he knew it. He gave back the medals before they took them. Guilty. Plain and simple. I used to look up to him like alot of people do, but not anymore. And like I said in my previous post, if they didnt have concrete DNA evidence, they wouldnt be pushing it. No politics.....not everything is a conspiracy theory, just most things.

Well, now we know... By his own admission, Lance was involved in systematic doping from the beginning, this was one big lie that he told time and time again and he was a jerk...

I was a big fan of Lance but in the back of my mind, I had to suspect something was not right. When Hincappie came out publicly, I knew the jig was up. Lance's admissions combined with the pressure Trek Bicycles put on Greg Lemond and his wife to retract their statements now looks bad for Trek.

Jon

Jon