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Posts Made By: Joe Lentz

November 30, 2004 12:53 AM Forum: Politics

Ukraine

Posted By Joe Lentz

My sympathies are of course with those who seek democracy and want to join with the European union. But a fair election will be the root of any legitimacy by either faction. Lets hope this can be resolved without major bloodshed. Opinions?

Ukraine President Says New Vote Possible

By Natasha Lisova
The Associated Press

Monday 29 November 2004

Kiev, Ukraine - Facing a relentless tide of opposition protests, embattled President Leonid Kuchma said Monday that a new election might be the only way out of a spiraling crisis that threatens to split this former Soviet republic into a pro-Russian east and a pro-Western rest of Ukraine.

Kuchma warned that "we cannot in any instance allow the disintegration or division of Ukraine," and Secretary of State Colin Powell said he had telephoned the Ukrainian president to express concern about reports of a possible splintering of the country.

Kuchma - who along with the Kremlin has staunchly supported the official winner of the disputed Nov. 21 runoff, his Prime Minister Viktor Yanukovych - has called for compromise throughout the standoff but had not previously endorsed another vote.

"If we really want to preserve peace and harmony, if we really want to build a democratic state ... let's hold new elections," said Kuchma, who did not seek another term. He said Ukraine needs a "legitimate president" and added that the crisis could be resolved through a "constitutional agreement" endorsed by parliament, suggesting existing law might not be flexible enough to accommodate a settlement.

While it fell short of meeting protesters' hopes that opposition leader Viktor Yushchenko would be named president, Kuchma's statement appeared to be at least a tacit admission that the election was tainted.

Yanukovych, who was declared the winner of the runoff by a margin of 871,402 votes, said he would support another vote if allegations of fraud in the election are proven - but that he had yet to see such proof.

Yushchenko has pushed for a new vote to settle the runoff, but Kuchma's remarks suggested the government may want to start the whole election process over. Kuchma's statement could also indicate a desire to win a respite from the relentless opposition blockade of official buildings.

Kuchma spoke as Yushchenko's supporters contested the vote in the Supreme Court, demanding that it cancel the official results because of evidence of fraud.

Addressing tens of thousands of supporters who flooded central Kiev for the eighth straight day, Yushchenko urged them to maintain their vigil despite freezing temperatures. "The next couple of days will bring a solution," Yushchenko said, as the crowd shouted in support.

He said he expects the court's verdict soon, and added that the opposition would also try Tuesday to topple Yanukovych's Cabinet through a no-confidence motion in parliament.

But in a sign of division in Yanukovych's camp, Serhiy Tyhypko resigned as his campaign chief and also stepped down as Central Bank chairman.

Kuchma warned that the country's financial system could "fall apart like a house of cards" in "a few days."

"Neither the president nor the government can be held responsible for this," he said. "The government cannot work in a normal way as you can all clearly see."

Yanukovych told Powell's deputy, Richard Armitage, that he had sought to moderate the pro-Russia eastern regions' push for autonomy, but added that "if the opposition fails to compromise, the threat of Ukraine's break up remains real," the Interfax news agency reported.

"There is little time left for finding a balanced political decision: not even days, but hours," Yanukovych said, according to Interfax. "If we don't do that, the situation may spin out of control."

Yanukovych's native Donetsk province scheduled an autonomy referendum for Sunday, and other eastern regions threatened to follow suit if Yanukovych is shut out of the presidency.

Russian-speakers are concentrated in the eastern industrial heartland of Ukraine. Many easterners feel a growing alienation from the more western regions - ruled by Poland until the 1700s - where voters overwhelmingly supported Yushchenko's reformist program and orientation toward Europe. Eastern Ukraine is more heavily populated than the west, and many of its citizens - coal miners and factory workers - see themselves as holding the country together economically.

A spokesman for Yushchenko's campaign in the eastern Luhansk region, Dmitriy Malikov, said several dozen Yanukovych supporters armed with brass knuckles and hammers beat about 70 Yushchenko supporters. He said some 20 people were injured, including a Canadian election monitor.

In a conversation with Armitage, Yanukovych said that his son had been attacked and other family members had been pressured by the opposition, prompting him to send his family out of Kiev.

The opposition has voiced fears that Kuchma or his aides might try to introduce a state of emergency, but Defense Minister Oleksandr Kuzmuk ruled it out and said the army wouldn't move against the people.

Ukraine's election crisis has pitted Russia against the United States and other Western nations, which have refused to accept official results. Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov told Powell on Monday that the dispute must be resolved in accordance with Ukrainian law.

Under Ukrainian legislation, the Supreme Court cannot rule on the overall results but can declare results invalid in individual precincts. Mykola Katerinchuk, a Yushchenko aide, said the appeal focused on results in eight eastern and southern Ukrainian regions - more than 15 million votes, almost half of the total cast in the runoff.

The Supreme Court said last week that the official election results could not be published until it rules on Yushchenko's challenge - effectively blocking Yanukovych's inauguration. On Saturday, parliament passed a nonbinding resolution declaring the election invalid.




December 13, 2004 02:53 AM Forum: Politics

Re: To my conservative friends, a history lesson

Posted By Joe Lentz

Well Ray, you are absolutely right. We are making many of the same mistakes in Iraq we made in Vietnam. And why would anyone be surprised that Patrick here fails to get it when people like Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Cheney and Georgie boy don't even get it? Heck, George's own father understood the dangers in Iraq much better than the son.

As incomprehensible as it may seem, some people act as though they have no use for the lessons of history, or don't even understand why those lessons are timeless. One thing for sure, for better or worse (worse in my view) we have committed ourselves to Iraq. I'll bet anyone here we'll still have at least 100K troops there when Bush's term is up. The fallout from this will be around long after little George has gone back to cutting brush on his ranch.

December 19, 2004 03:35 PM Forum: Politics

US foreign aid as % of GNP

Posted By Joe Lentz

This is pretty interesting, I suspect a lot of people here believe the figure to be much higher than it really is. I know I did. In fact a poll showed most americans believe the figure is over 20%! It amazes me how much inaccurate information most americans seem to have about their own country. Check it out:

"The U.S. foreign-aid budget as a percentage of gross national product (GNP) ranks last among the world’s wealthiest countries (at about 0.1 percent). In raw dollars, however, the United States is now the world’s top donor of economic aid, although for more than a decade it was second to Japan, which is far smaller and has been beset by economic woes. In 2001, the United States gave $10.9 billion, Japan $9.7 billion, Germany $4.9 billion, the United Kingdom $4.7 billion, and France $4.3 billion. As a percentage of GNP, however, the top donors were Denmark, Norway, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, and Sweden. The tiny Netherlands (pop. 16.3 million) gave $3.2 billion in 2001—almost a third of what America contributed."

http://www.cfrterrorism.org/policy/foreignaid.html#Q4

February 24, 2006 11:02 PM Forum: Politics

Cartoon riots

Posted By Joe Lentz

The subject line isn't meant to be glib, but I know most folks will realize what is being referenced by it. I expect you guys have already talked about this here, but I wanted to revisit it in order to share a quote from Ralph Waldo Emerson, a quote I thought fit it well:

"The great army of cowards who bellow and bully...have no confidence in truth or God. Truth will not maintain itself, they fancy, unless they bolster it up, and whip and stone the assailants;...the being of God they seem to think dependent on what we say of it."

That quote also applies equally to activist, intolerant religious groups of any stripe afaic. The meaning of the quote aside, respect and appreciation of differences in belief can go a long way toward smoother relations between differing cultures. That in no way negates freedom of expression.

February 28, 2006 02:27 PM Forum: Politics

Re: Just in time

Posted By Joe Lentz

Funny how Jim B. paints the dems as the party of hate because they have the audacity to point out the incompetence and corruption that exists in this administration. Better to keep quiet about that stuff eh Jim! After all the dirty water that's gone over the dam in the past several months, all the info that's come to light, and some folks still refuse to shake the sand out of their ears! Absolutely amazing...

September 4, 2006 06:11 PM Forum: Equipment Talk

TeleVue 60° Everbrite Diagonal

Posted By Joe Lentz

I'm considering a dual purpose diagonal - terrestrial & astronomy, but without the usual compromise in optical quality when it comes to high powers. Specifically, I'm interested in whether or not the 60° Everbrite is optically the equal of the 90° Everbrite. Thoughts? Facts? Suggestions?

November 6, 2006 12:54 PM Forum: Politics

America

Posted By Joe Lentz

Monday, the day before another election. I don't know about you, but tomorrow's an important day in my book. Important enough that being this close to it is distracting me from my sleep and giving me a headache. Maybe the latter is from all the campaign ads though. My hope and prayer, as always, is that we in America will vote as an informed people, a people who are at least knowledgeable enough of our history to appreciate the importance of our responsibility. And above all I hope we are knowledgeable enough to vote for our country, not our party.

At this particular juncture however, a more immediate hope is that we've learned enough about the govenment we've lived under for the past 6 years to have learned about the gulf between what it says and what it's done. In short, I hope we've learned enough to not let the wool get pulled over our eyes again. I realize that given past performance of the electorate, this may be a vain hope, but my love for this country is strong enough to maintain it nonetheless. I just wish I didn't have this headache.

September 4, 2002 11:44 AM Forum: Equipment Talk

Ed Beck Mirrors

Posted By Joe Lentz

Brad, I just ran across your post from last April during a search, and wondered; did you or anyone else find out anything about Ed Beck? I have an 8" f/5 mirror he made for me several years ago. He did a nice job on it and I am very happy with it. How do you like the one you found?

Joe

December 31, 2002 10:19 PM Forum: Religion

Everyone is being nice

Posted By Joe Lentz

Umm... I think so!

HAPPY NEW YEARS!!!!!!!!!!

Hope 2003 is a better year for all of us...

January 3, 2003 12:36 AM Forum: Religion

Jerusalem syndrome and delusions

Posted By Joe Lentz

Very interesting Mike. I seem to remember reading somewhere once that in certain forms of mental illness a belief that one is Jesus Christ is not particularly uncommon. I don't say this to be provocative, but only as a point of information, in context with the quote you provided by Amos Elon.