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NUT JOB

Started by NebSteve, 04/21/2011 07:31PM
Posted 04/21/2011 07:31PM Opening Post
OK, I'm looking for all your coments as we obviously have both sides of the house and a wide spectrum of religious beliefs repersented here. Let's set all Political and Christian references off to one side or the other for a moment. Just simple answers for our our sense of clarity please...

First, I've always considered a protest to include writing to Congress or sitting in a lawn chair holding a sign that says something sucks. I thought an activist is someone who says; "Let's all go down to Central Park and do this protest together." I've never considered a "protest" to include riots, or burning anything, much less our flag.

Some questions:
In spite of what the courts have said; do you guys consider disrupting the funeral of anyone, much less a United States Marine, a protest or a severe breach of common decency? Anything in between?

In incidents like those at Servicemen's funerals, do you consider the media coverage to be irresponsible; working in favor of the Phelps's of the world?

As the courts have failed to stop this, how could we work within the law to solve this one particular problem and still grant the media freedom of the press, and the average citizen freedom to protest?

I hate to see anyone beat up, but it is very likely I too would have looked the other way in Mississippi. That's why I'm asking for some constructive method.

Thanks,
Steve
8)


Posted 04/21/2011 07:40PM #1
There seems to be a collision of two deeply held principles, that being the right of privacy and the right of free speech. I personally feel that the right of privacy should trump free speech, and the courts should go further to protect privacy than they do. You have the right to say whatever you want...except in my own house.
Posted 04/21/2011 07:54PM | Edited 04/21/2011 08:03PM #2
Steve Hollenbach said:

OK, I'm looking for all your coments as we obviously have both sides of the house and a wide spectrum of religious beliefs repersented here. Let's set all Political and Christian references off to one side or the other for a moment. Just simple answers for our our sense of clarity please...

First, I've always considered a protest to include writing to Congress or sitting in a lawn chair holding a sign that says something sucks. I thought an activist is someone who says; "Let's all go down to Central Park and do this protest together." I've never considered a "protest" to include riots, or burning anything, much less our flag.

Some questions:
In spite of what the courts have said; do you guys consider disrupting the funeral of anyone, much less a United States Marine, a protest or a severe breach of common decency? Anything in between?

In incidents like those at Servicemen's funerals, do you consider the media coverage to be irresponsible; working in favor of the Phelps's of the world?

As the courts have failed to stop this, how could we work within the law to solve this one particular problem and still grant the media freedom of the press, and the average citizen freedom to protest?

I hate to see anyone beat up, but it is very likely I too would have looked the other way in Mississippi. That's why I'm asking for some constructive method.

Thanks,
Steve
8)



Steve:

In my view, the word protest would include activities such as starting a protest riot. But no right is absolute. Thus the free speech right to protest gives way to public safety and your speech rights can be very legally curbed with your arrest and some jail time if you start a riot.

To my knowledge, Phelps has never physically disrupted a funeral. According to the Supreme Court case of about a month ago, he was peacefully protesting on public land across the way from the funeral. In fact, the funeral attendees could not see him or hear him unless they looked for him

This is a reasonable balance of his right to free speech with the privacy rights of the bereaved and the property rights of the funeral home/cemetery. I would not change anything.

If Phelps actually disrupted a funeral by being physically present on the premises, he would and should be arrested for disturbing the peace or trespass.

I think that the present law which requires him to protest on public land some distance away from the private funeral is a workable solution.

Jim

[SIZE="Small"]p.s. I think Phelp's activities are both a protest and a breach of all decency.

p.s.s. In general, I think that the media coverage is acceptable. I do not want them self-censoring. It would not bother me of course if the media did not cover this.

p.s.s.s My 18yo kid went to a counter-protest to protest Phelps last fall. They were placed by the police in a park far far away, where they carried "Peace" and "God Loves Everyone" signs. (My kid presently does not believe in God, but that's a different story).

Anyway, the counter protest got no media coverage at all. The kids were bummed.

J[/SIZE]
Posted 04/21/2011 08:39PM #3
Steve Hollenbach said:

First, I've always considered a protest to include writing to Congress or sitting in a lawn chair holding a sign that says something sucks. I thought an activist is someone who says; "Let's all go down to Central Park and do this protest together." I've never considered a "protest" to include riots, or burning anything, much less our flag.


I agree with the above....but I would add I consider Phelps to definately be an activist/rabble rouser/asshole, take your pick of the 1st two, the last is a given.


Some questions:
In spite of what the courts have said; do you guys consider disrupting the funeral of anyone, much less a United States Marine, a protest or a severe breach of common decency? Anything in between?

Personally in the case of what Westboro does I consider it a traitorous act and wish with all my heart that anyone associated it could be sent packing out of this country smile
IMO the one that got his arse whipped got exactly what he deserved.

In incidents like those at Servicemen's funerals, do you consider the media coverage to be irresponsible; working in favor of the Phelps's of the world?

I am not sure which side of the fence I am on this one..... I know I am grateful that the media gave me forewarning of something I might encounter at a military funeral. Were something like that to catch me by surprise I am pretty sure someone would tote an arse whipping right quick like.....As it is I have forewarning of what I might encounter thanks to the media covering it which also prepares me mentally so I dont fly off the handle and violate someones personal space in such a way as to warrant some prison time smile

As the courts have failed to stop this, how could we work within the law to solve this one particular problem and still grant the media freedom of the press, and the average citizen freedom to protest?

Passing a law that says tehy cant stage a protest within 10 miles of a military funeral would make me happy.

I hate to see anyone beat up, but it is very likely I too would have looked the other way in Mississippi. That's why I'm asking for some constructive method.

I agree but not in this particular situation...Not only would I look the other way but would be happy to shake the hand of the guy that did it.

Thanks,
Steve




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