Even though these events are on different weekends, I do not have the luxury of being able to attend both. I have attended Astrofest for over 15 years and have always enjoyed the event. So what are the thoughts out there? If you had to choose between the two, which would you go to and why? I "assume" that the vendors will stick with the Astrofest name, but I could be all wet.
Astrofest or Prairie Skies??!!
Started by swsands, 07/19/2004 12:20PM
Posted 07/19/2004 12:20PM
Opening Post
Posted 07/19/2004 08:47PM
#1
LIKE YOU STEVE I`M NOT SURE, AND MY DAUGHTER, WHO HAS ALWAYS COME WITH ISNT HAPPY ABOUT THE SITE CHANGE. SOMETHING ABOUT EXPLORING THE CAMP GROUNGS AND HAVING FUN DOING IT. I`VE SEEN THE PICTURES OF VANAS AND THOUGH GOOD FOR OBSERVING, IT DOESNT DO MUCH FOR THE EXPLORER IN MY DAUGHTER OR NEPHEW.Hope to figure this out soon times running out.
Posted 07/20/2004 01:10AM
#2
A few of club members are going to both, but the group (Rockford Amateur Astronomers) has decided to go to Prairie Skies because of the site and what it has to offer over the new AstroFest site. Camp Shaw is just more appealing because of its natural setting, seclusion from traffic and housing, and it's familiar 
.
About the only thing that we would miss is the vendors, so lets hope they don't all go to one or the other.
Robert W.
.About the only thing that we would miss is the vendors, so lets hope they don't all go to one or the other.
Robert W.
There's no substitute for fine glass!
Posted 07/21/2004 07:57PM
| Edited 07/21/2004 07:59PM
#3
As an Astrofest attendee for most of the past 15 years, I thought that a common complaint was the lack of decent skies, due to the proximity to Chicago. Is that not why they moved it?
Anyway, two years ago a group of us from Ann Arbor (Lowbrows) started going to the Black Forest Star Party, in north central PA, which is often about the same time as Astrofest. Longer drive, but much better skies, and not quite as crowded. We miss the Astro Dogs tho.
At least there's no one yelling "Crystal!" all night. 
Doug
Anyway, two years ago a group of us from Ann Arbor (Lowbrows) started going to the Black Forest Star Party, in north central PA, which is often about the same time as Astrofest. Longer drive, but much better skies, and not quite as crowded. We miss the Astro Dogs tho.
At least there's no one yelling "Crystal!" all night. Doug
Posted 07/22/2004 04:13AM
#4
Rumors are just that, RUMORS ... so let me put it to rest for everyone. Prairie Skies is not going to be canceled because of low registration!! Short of a tornado, earthquake, etc., Prairie Skies WILL be held on September 9-12, 2004. I should know, I'm running the event! What's "low registration", anyway? Sounds like someone is making a last ditch effort to discourage registrations .. for some reason!? For what it's worth, we would [U]never take money from people and then cancel an event without refunding 100% of their registration fee!
Posted 07/23/2004 04:25AM
#6
Steve,
I'm going to be doing the Prarie Skies party instead of the new Astrofest. I too have been going to A/fest for over a decade and have come to look forward to the event. Its truly sad that this all had to take place, but in the end what I enjoy about Astrofest the most IS it's location. Sure, I would like darker skies, but I do plenty of dark sky observing on my own, and don't really miss it that much at camp Shaw. Besides, Vana's (the afest location) is only about 6-10 miles away from Camp Shaw...I doubt the skies are all that much darker.
I'm sorry, but CAS's idea to hold a star party in the middle of a farmer's field sounds ridicules. Camp Shaw has the best amenities for such an event. Amentities like SHOWERS, flush toilets for the more serious rest room breaks, buildings to hang out in if it rains, a cool canyon, etc. The decision in my mind is a no-brainer; Camp Shaw-wan-na-see all the way!
I'm going to be doing the Prarie Skies party instead of the new Astrofest. I too have been going to A/fest for over a decade and have come to look forward to the event. Its truly sad that this all had to take place, but in the end what I enjoy about Astrofest the most IS it's location. Sure, I would like darker skies, but I do plenty of dark sky observing on my own, and don't really miss it that much at camp Shaw. Besides, Vana's (the afest location) is only about 6-10 miles away from Camp Shaw...I doubt the skies are all that much darker.
I'm sorry, but CAS's idea to hold a star party in the middle of a farmer's field sounds ridicules. Camp Shaw has the best amenities for such an event. Amentities like SHOWERS, flush toilets for the more serious rest room breaks, buildings to hang out in if it rains, a cool canyon, etc. The decision in my mind is a no-brainer; Camp Shaw-wan-na-see all the way!
Posted 07/25/2004 03:03AM
#7
Fellow observers:
Once again, here is a short evaluative article that I first posted to this forum during the third week of May. I hope it answers a few questions that people may have on the Prairie Skies vs. Astrofest issue.
Bart
__________________________
ONE OBSERVER'S OPINION OF THE NEW ASTROFEST SITE
Last Saturday, I attended the Chicago Astronomical Society's Comet Quest Picnic at Vana's Farm, which is the new site for Astrofest 2004. Since there has been much discussion lately about the two competing star parties this September -- the Prairie Skies Star Party at the former Astrofest site at Camp Shaw on September 9-12 and Astrofest at Vana's Farm on September 16-19, I thought I'd express a few of my own observations of the site and its merits as a dark sky observing location.
For the record, I am a long-standing member of the Chicago Astronomical Society, the Northwest Suburban Astronomers, and the Peoria Astronomical Society. Since much of the new Astrofest / old Astrofest issue has been grounded in some rather heated internal fighting between factions of the original Astrofest committee and the Chicago Astronomical Society, I should probably preface my remarks by saying that I respect both groups of people connected with Astrofest -- the persons who once managed Astrofest (who are now likely to manage the Prairie Skies Star Party) and the current C.A.S. people who have decide to move Astrofest to a new location. I have no axes to grind and (like many people) are simply trying to gather enough information to decide which event to attend this September, if not both.
Vana's Farm consists of several small buildings located just off a gravel driveway from State Route 17 (about 10 miles due west of Kankakee) and a large, flat, grass-covered observing field a few hundred yards north (away from) that same road. For Comet Quest, one of the buildings was used as the dining room for the buffet dinner that they provided. By the way, the food was excellent -- far better and less "institutionalized" in flavor than any food I've ever experienced at Astrofest -- and it was "all you can eat." If the same is planned for Astrofest 2004, then registrants will be well fed, if nothing else. However, since event organizers will need MUCH more dining space for that event than this one, I'm guessing that they will rent tents or some other type of temporary structures to handle the large number of diners and buffet lines.
The Comet Quest observing was held on one small, very flat, section of the much larger farm. However, the full extent of what will be used for Astrofest 2004 (which I've read is 20 acres) was pointed out to me and others. Although these other portions of the large observing field are currently sprouting a rather sparse crop of grass, I am confident that the grass will fully grow in by September, thereby eliminating the chance of a "Mudfest" experience. FYI: heavy rains in the days before Comet Quest had no adverse effect on the portion of the observing field that we used. The full observing field is much larger than the main observing field at Camp Shaw and the horizons to the north, east and south are superb -- much better than Camp Shaw's. There is a tree line to the west that poses a similar amount of obstruction as the tree lines at Camp Shaw. However, the excellent horizons have a downside -- bright light pollution near the horizon that is normally shielded by trees is readily visible, and farm lights farther down the road (in the direction of southeast) are glaringly apparent, as are distant car headlights on Route 17. I was told, however, that a crop of corn strategically planted between the main observing field and the road will obstruct these lights by September.
Vana's Farm lacks many of the amenities of Camp Shaw. There are no cabins; everyone must either camp or drive to a nearby motel. No charcoal or open fires will be permitted, but I was told that you'll be allowed to cook on "Coleman" style propane gas stoves. There are no showers or toilets, although I understand that both will be brought in for Astrofest. Most worrisome to me is that without a large permanent structure, it could be very uncomfortable on the large observing field in the event of (dare I say) heavy rain or severe weather. I've been told that C.A.S. has a five-year contract with Vana's Farm, and that accumulated profits from each Astrofest will eventually be used to purchase land for a new Astrofest site, perhaps at an even darker location.
So what about the relative darkness of the skies? First, let me say that the Comet Quest night provided an excellent test -- a cold front had recently passed and the air was very transparent with low humidity. Overall, I believe that the sky darkness at Vana's Farm was comparable to Camp Shaw, but not significantly better. Frankly, I had hoped for darker skies than I saw there. To its credit, the sky at Vana's Farm is darker to the south, since the lights of Kankakee are located due east of the observing site instead of to the southeast, as they are at Camp Shaw. As any observer would admit, having a dark south horizon is an important attribute for any observing site. However, the eastern sky seemed worse to me at Vana's vs. Camp Shaw, while west and north are probably about the same at both sites. Overall, I would take issue with the Comet Quest promotional information supplied by C.A.S. that called Vana's Farm a "very dark site." It's not.
A star party means many different things to different people. For some, it's primarily a social gathering -- a sort of extended astro-campout. For others, it's a great chance to buy and sell equipment. For others, the food is really important. For me, it's always been primarily the observing. Since I'm rarely able to observe outside our perpetually light polluted metro area, events like Astrofest provide a rare opportunity for me to do so. So unlike many others, my primary interest is to observe with a couple of good friends well into the wee hours of the morning. Quite frankly, I don't care much how many vendors are present or how big the swap fest is, or how plentiful the food is, or how comfortable the cabins are. For me, it's all about the skies and how free of clouds and free of light pollution they are. In my opinion, the skies at Vana's Farm are not such an improvement over Camp Shaw to offset the loss of Camp Shaw's many facilities -- showers, cabins, plentiful toilets and a permanent structure in case (God forbid) it rains. For many years, I've quietly advocated a move for Astrofest, but to a location that is significantly darker than Camp Shaw. As far as that's concerned, Vana's Farm falls short.
Bart Benjamin
Once again, here is a short evaluative article that I first posted to this forum during the third week of May. I hope it answers a few questions that people may have on the Prairie Skies vs. Astrofest issue.
Bart
__________________________
ONE OBSERVER'S OPINION OF THE NEW ASTROFEST SITE
Last Saturday, I attended the Chicago Astronomical Society's Comet Quest Picnic at Vana's Farm, which is the new site for Astrofest 2004. Since there has been much discussion lately about the two competing star parties this September -- the Prairie Skies Star Party at the former Astrofest site at Camp Shaw on September 9-12 and Astrofest at Vana's Farm on September 16-19, I thought I'd express a few of my own observations of the site and its merits as a dark sky observing location.
For the record, I am a long-standing member of the Chicago Astronomical Society, the Northwest Suburban Astronomers, and the Peoria Astronomical Society. Since much of the new Astrofest / old Astrofest issue has been grounded in some rather heated internal fighting between factions of the original Astrofest committee and the Chicago Astronomical Society, I should probably preface my remarks by saying that I respect both groups of people connected with Astrofest -- the persons who once managed Astrofest (who are now likely to manage the Prairie Skies Star Party) and the current C.A.S. people who have decide to move Astrofest to a new location. I have no axes to grind and (like many people) are simply trying to gather enough information to decide which event to attend this September, if not both.
Vana's Farm consists of several small buildings located just off a gravel driveway from State Route 17 (about 10 miles due west of Kankakee) and a large, flat, grass-covered observing field a few hundred yards north (away from) that same road. For Comet Quest, one of the buildings was used as the dining room for the buffet dinner that they provided. By the way, the food was excellent -- far better and less "institutionalized" in flavor than any food I've ever experienced at Astrofest -- and it was "all you can eat." If the same is planned for Astrofest 2004, then registrants will be well fed, if nothing else. However, since event organizers will need MUCH more dining space for that event than this one, I'm guessing that they will rent tents or some other type of temporary structures to handle the large number of diners and buffet lines.
The Comet Quest observing was held on one small, very flat, section of the much larger farm. However, the full extent of what will be used for Astrofest 2004 (which I've read is 20 acres) was pointed out to me and others. Although these other portions of the large observing field are currently sprouting a rather sparse crop of grass, I am confident that the grass will fully grow in by September, thereby eliminating the chance of a "Mudfest" experience. FYI: heavy rains in the days before Comet Quest had no adverse effect on the portion of the observing field that we used. The full observing field is much larger than the main observing field at Camp Shaw and the horizons to the north, east and south are superb -- much better than Camp Shaw's. There is a tree line to the west that poses a similar amount of obstruction as the tree lines at Camp Shaw. However, the excellent horizons have a downside -- bright light pollution near the horizon that is normally shielded by trees is readily visible, and farm lights farther down the road (in the direction of southeast) are glaringly apparent, as are distant car headlights on Route 17. I was told, however, that a crop of corn strategically planted between the main observing field and the road will obstruct these lights by September.
Vana's Farm lacks many of the amenities of Camp Shaw. There are no cabins; everyone must either camp or drive to a nearby motel. No charcoal or open fires will be permitted, but I was told that you'll be allowed to cook on "Coleman" style propane gas stoves. There are no showers or toilets, although I understand that both will be brought in for Astrofest. Most worrisome to me is that without a large permanent structure, it could be very uncomfortable on the large observing field in the event of (dare I say) heavy rain or severe weather. I've been told that C.A.S. has a five-year contract with Vana's Farm, and that accumulated profits from each Astrofest will eventually be used to purchase land for a new Astrofest site, perhaps at an even darker location.
So what about the relative darkness of the skies? First, let me say that the Comet Quest night provided an excellent test -- a cold front had recently passed and the air was very transparent with low humidity. Overall, I believe that the sky darkness at Vana's Farm was comparable to Camp Shaw, but not significantly better. Frankly, I had hoped for darker skies than I saw there. To its credit, the sky at Vana's Farm is darker to the south, since the lights of Kankakee are located due east of the observing site instead of to the southeast, as they are at Camp Shaw. As any observer would admit, having a dark south horizon is an important attribute for any observing site. However, the eastern sky seemed worse to me at Vana's vs. Camp Shaw, while west and north are probably about the same at both sites. Overall, I would take issue with the Comet Quest promotional information supplied by C.A.S. that called Vana's Farm a "very dark site." It's not.
A star party means many different things to different people. For some, it's primarily a social gathering -- a sort of extended astro-campout. For others, it's a great chance to buy and sell equipment. For others, the food is really important. For me, it's always been primarily the observing. Since I'm rarely able to observe outside our perpetually light polluted metro area, events like Astrofest provide a rare opportunity for me to do so. So unlike many others, my primary interest is to observe with a couple of good friends well into the wee hours of the morning. Quite frankly, I don't care much how many vendors are present or how big the swap fest is, or how plentiful the food is, or how comfortable the cabins are. For me, it's all about the skies and how free of clouds and free of light pollution they are. In my opinion, the skies at Vana's Farm are not such an improvement over Camp Shaw to offset the loss of Camp Shaw's many facilities -- showers, cabins, plentiful toilets and a permanent structure in case (God forbid) it rains. For many years, I've quietly advocated a move for Astrofest, but to a location that is significantly darker than Camp Shaw. As far as that's concerned, Vana's Farm falls short.
Bart Benjamin
Posted 08/28/2004 03:47AM
#8
I attended the past two AstroFests and found them to be wonderful. I used to attend the Riverside conference and, after moving to the Midwest, was pleased to find that AstroFest was just as nice an event. Riverside's advantages are darker skies and beautiful mountaintop location.
I think that Camp Shaw is a wonderful facility and is ideal for a large star party. Even without the star party, Camp Shaw is a pleasant place to spend a couple days.
To me it appears that Vana's Farm is too close to a major highway, and that the observers will experience car noise and headlights during the star party.
With some hesitation, I decided to attend the new AstroFest this year. I will definitely consider Prairie Skies next year.
I think that Camp Shaw is a wonderful facility and is ideal for a large star party. Even without the star party, Camp Shaw is a pleasant place to spend a couple days.
To me it appears that Vana's Farm is too close to a major highway, and that the observers will experience car noise and headlights during the star party.
With some hesitation, I decided to attend the new AstroFest this year. I will definitely consider Prairie Skies next year.
Michael Aaron McNeely
TeleVue Forum Moderator
Astromart.com
Funding Member
