Astonished & Disappointed - Please Comment

I'm 40 and haven't had a telescope since I was 11 and I haven't viewed since then. I have been reaquainting myself with astronomy researching different telescope types with goal of purchasing a scope in the $5k range.

I had a viewing opportunity last night from a very gracious owner of a 24" Starmaster w/ startracker, he had 25+ yrs astronomy experience and one of his observing friends attending had over 30 yrs in the hobby.
These experienced gents commented about the favorable viewing conditons. I wanted to see a scope of this caliber because there are so many people that aspire to own these big aperture scopes. We started the evening looking at Mars, when you total the value of the scope, EP's, and accessories its $15k; I approached the EP (400x) with excitement I looked and there was Mars and the two moons and here is where the disappointment begins, the polar cap was visible with color variations through the planet but it was a flat disc and the two moons were dimly lit nondescript starlike specs. We moved onto Uranus and Neptune and one of the moons Titania? was visible along with other moons; their was oohs from the guy with 30+ yrs commented some of these moons he had never seen and this was a night he would never forget. I began to feel guilty here was a man that had committed 30 yrs to a hobby and was see things for the first time and I hadn't looked in a telescope in almost as many years and I was experiencing quite a let down. I asked if we could look at Andromeda, I remember the $$$$31mm Nagler was used very, very fine optics- the core looked like a snowball that hit a picture window frosted slightly in a circular pattern, the owner said if the skys were truly dark the dust trails would be visible. Back to Mars I asked to see it at high magnification it brought up to just over 1200x, it was bigger, but not in my face. We concluded with the moon that was spectacular!!

When I take a family photo when the picture is developed I don't expect to just see the whites of their eyes I expect: color, background, three dimensionalty etc. When people look at astrophotos they see these elements, get excited about the hobby, run out buy a telescope only to be disappointed I was just amazed with this level of fine equipment and the results. I hope to go out again with the Starmaster setup again in the future in a really dark favorable location, but unless I experience some wows I think my $5k will be going elsewhere.
I purposely omitted the location because I didn't discuss my comments with the people present last night - I don't want to hurt anyone and if any of the individuals present last night reads this I intend no disrespect nor is my intention to disparage the equipment used or amateur astronomy. I would appreciate any positive comments or insights that any one might have as I have not closed the door on pursuing astronomy as a hobby. Thankyou in advance for comments!

Observing is a skill. And, it doesn't look like television or images from the Hubble (which is significantly larger than the Starmaster and above the earth's atmosphere, and usually involves pretty sophisticated image processing). So, you're quite right, it doesn't have the visual wow factor, and my wife would agree with wildly on this. My 7 year old daughter's commets on observing Mars 44 hours after it made its closest pass to Earth in 58,00 years was "no, i can't see anything on the surface. Oh, I can see the polar ice cap . . . It looks like a white speck. You know, if we don't know what that was . . . it would look pretty boring."

But, we did know what it was, and something of how far away it was (c. 38,000,000 miles), and it is this acumulated knowledge and experience that can make the experience fill me with wonder, and my daughter, but not my wife. My experience is that most people couldn't care less, and there is no great failing in that. As a historian, I would suggest that our culture demands overstimulation. And, in astronomy, most of the stimulation is in the immagination, not the retinal image. As one becomes a more experienced and skilled observer (and I'm probably garden variety in both)the images get better, but its still the imagination that keeps me out at night--I mean that light from the Sombrero Galaxy is 65 million years old, and I can see it right now. Who said Jurasiac period?

This year was the first time I had been to a dark sky sight in over 10 years.

I own an 8" SCT and a 4" wide field refractor. At this dark sky site I could see the Milky Way in all it's glory and more stars than I ever thought were possible.

I was in such awe. I laid down on a blanket and for many hours just looked up and contemplated life. I was lying there and thought how, for millions, billions of years all of what I was looking at was going through it's own development...long before mankind ever even existed.

Then I thought of my own existence and thought how foolish I've been with all of my insignificant worries and complaints.

That night of viewing the stars was a mind altering, life changing experience...and I never, not once, even looked through my scope.

It cost me absolutely nothing to have this view. My point is that a telescope is not a tool to gather Hubble-like photos in the eyepiece as if it were a kids picture slide show.

It is merely a tool to take your mind to a different place and time. Its all about perspective. A telescope should help you gain perspective on the universe and your insignificant place in it.

You were expecting more? To ONLY expect a Hubble image in the eyepiece is to expect far less.

Gary,

I'll second the comments that've already been made, and add that visual observing of subtle, fine details is a learned skill acquired with experience over time. A 24" Starmaster is a high quality instrument which will deliver far more detail for an experienced observer than a newcomer. An analogy with a musical instrument is appropriate: I can plunk out some notes and chords on my old upright, but I wouldn't have enough experience to play a Steinway to it's best advantage.

As with many other endeavors in life, don't expect instant gratification from an expensive telescope. More than money, you need to invest your time and effort to reap the rewards. And as you grow in experience, the payoffs will be there. As others have recommended, start off with a modest investment in a pair of binoculars or small telescope. Learn what you can from that, and build on that experience.

Howard K

I can think of three sights that made me gasp with delight. (1) My first view of a globular cluster with a 10" Newtonian, when I could actually resolve some stars for the first time. (2) The Orion Nebula (M42) through the same Newtonian. (3) The Andromeda Galaxy (M31) through 25x100 binoculars.

Aside from these, it's true that most telescopic sights are not what most people would consider spectacular. Some of the enjoyment comes from knowing what it is you are looking at, as others have commented. There is also a sense of satisfaction in finally being able to see a dim object that you've spent a lot of time hunting down.

Looking through a telescope is the nearest most of us will ever get to spaceflight. In looking at a galaxy through a telescope, you see almost exactly what you would see on an intergalactic space flight. There is something to be said for first-hand experience. Why do people travel thousands of miles to see the Grand Canyon instead of just looking at pictures or videos? Hubble photos are wonderful, but there's something better about looking at an object with your own eye(s), aided by the optics, and seeing what it REALLY looks like.

Thank you for your honest comments; I'm sure they reflect what many others feel.

I looked at M15 this morning (first time I've seen it), Mars and Uranus. I could make out some of the stars of M15 at 374x, Uranus was a tiny disc and Mars was bright but hard to make out detail with the turbulent atmosphere. I enjoy looking at the stars as I search for objects, even when I don't find something in particular I have a great time looking.